CrashinConvos
This podcast is all about exploring the ups and downs of life, wellness, resilience and everything in between through the art of conversation.
We'll also dive into deep discussions on existential questions, philosophical thoughts, and how we are apart of something bigger.
By sharing my experiences along with those of my guests, I hope to bring you inspiration, and a sense of direction through connection which may help the listener begin to understand and unravel some situations y’all may be facing or at the very least entertained by some of our topics.
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CrashinConvos
The Art Of Reinvention: USAF To Artistic Freedom - Jake Valdez - Ep 78
In this episode, I sit down with Jake Valdez, USAF Veteran and owner of FleshElectric Tattoo.
Jake shares his inspiring journey from military service to building a thriving career in tattoo artistry. Starting from the bottom, he turned a passion for art into a business that reflects his creativity and resilience. We dive into the challenges of transitioning from military life to entrepreneurship, explore the balance between work, personal growth, and mental health, and discuss the role of cannabis as a medicinal tool for creativity and collaboration.
Join us for an honest, thought-provoking conversation on finding balance, purpose, and passion through art.
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When in San Antonio, Texas check out:
www.jakevaldez.com
IG: @fleshelectrictattoo
@jakevaldez
210-314-5686
2554 Blossom Drive
San Antonio, Texas
And then if you could when you have the mic you can just bring down to you have it to like four to six inches from your mouth because if you start to draw this one twist right? Yeah. This reminds me of back in the day. Yeah, getting into it. The stage recording and all that stuff. Yeah, go ahead and start this shit. Ah, you asshole. Yeah, obviously I don't have a fucking big studio budget. No, dude, but it looks great. What you got? Yeah, man.(...) And this is all like... These are GoPros? Yeah. Oh, okay, cool. And these are all... This is a 360, but I don't have it in 360 mode. I use it for... It's a cat... I fucking use it for writing. I use it for... I use it for... I use it for... I use it for... I use it for... I use it for... I use it for... I use it for... I use it for... I use it for... It's a cat... I fucking use it for writing. I use it for...(...) I'm just gonna try it out with my phone. It sucks too, man. I just found out one of my buddies, I don't know, he saw that...(...) I just saw that. Yeah. Sorry to hear that. Yeah, man, it sucks, but I'm glad he's not suffering anymore. But did he have cancer? Yeah. Fuck. Yeah, and it spread everywhere. I got to see him at the VA before he passed and stuff. How old is he? Young. He's like 38 or something. It sucks, man. It's terrible, man. Yeah. It's a scary one, dude, because... Yeah, I know. I've been pinging the VA too, I want to get some screenings done. Yeah. GoPro. F-fucking 80. I get distracted easy. I don't know, too. You're good, man. I'm just gonna... I'm just gonna... I'm just gonna... I'm just gonna... I'm just gonna... I'm just gonna... I'm just gonna... Come to the territory. Yeah. I mean, when you got a lot of stuff going on... Yeah. No shit, man. That's a true story. It's hard to stay, you know, just on the same mind path. Yeah. So, it's interesting you say that because... Yeah, I'm just checking the angle on this. Yeah, that's cool. It's interesting you say that because... I mean, obviously, you're a creative person, right? You're artistic, quite literally. Not autistic or artistic. And... But, yeah, man, I've been following your page for a while now. And I feel like...(...) I've noticed a pattern within artistic people. Like, they have a lot of stuff going on at once. Their mind's always constantly, like, thinking about the next thing or the new thing or past or present. It's like we're existing in all times at once. And with that, it comes with distraction. It brings a lot of noise. Yeah. Like, it's noisy. Yeah. I think that when you are creative, you do tend to look back at your old work.(...) And it's kind of weird because with tattooing, you're stuck in a time. If I do a tattoo and you're in 09, it's going to look the exact same way as it does today, right? So it freezes where you were at, where your artistic ability or influences were at that time.(...) So it's kind of a trip because things change over time. So when you look at a tattoo you did from 09, and you're like, "Oh, man, I could have done that different. I could have done that better." But looking back at it, it can also cause depression because you're looking like, "Oh, man, I could have done things differently." Yeah. And at the same time, it can create anxiety because it's like, "Well, where am I going with this? Do I have a direction?(...) Or am I just doing this to do it?" So it's interesting. No, and that's a good point because you... And it's so personal, right? Because you are pretty much putting your art on somebody's body. For sure. Yeah. And I'm pretty sure that... No, I don't think all tattoo artists are created equal. And within that, I wonder how many... I mean, you can actually see it, right? On some people, it's like the person either didn't have the talent or the artistry or the care to actually take their time and really... Or their experience. Or their experience, right. You get tattooed by somebody two years in. It's a different vibe than when you get tattooed by the same person 15 years in. Yeah. Because two years in, you're still...(...) Like in tattooing in particular, you spend your first couple of years trying to figure out your tools.(...) If you don't know how to use your tools, then it doesn't matter how good you can draw. You know what I mean? Like if I cannot get that thing into skin the way I drew it to be, then it doesn't matter how good the drawing is if I can't apply it to the skin. Yeah. So you spend your first two years just figuring out what your tools do and how to manipulate them for effects and different textures and all that stuff. So your first few years, like, yeah, I'm doing a rose, but while I'm doing that rose, I'm trying to figure out how the fuck I can get smooth shading on that rose. And it kind of sucks because there's no practice. It's all at the expense of someone else's skin. Now nowadays they do have that practice skin and stuff like that. It's not the same thing though. No. Yeah. And it's, I mean, not to say it's the same, but it kind of is like mountain biking, right? People, when they ride,(...) you can see their creativity when they ride, like how they ride, how they hit sections and like some... But it's also like people will buy the badass bike, right? And they think that it's going to make them a better rider. But if they don't know how to manipulate that machinery, then it doesn't matter. At the same time, you can get someone that gets a fucking Walmart huffy or whatever, go out there and crush, go and carve everything the fuck out. Like they lived on that mountain their whole life. Yeah. And I mean, that took me some time too, right? Because in my mind,(...) I call it like chasing the technology, right?(...) Some people will chase the tech, you know, like get the latest this, the latest that. Right. But it's like, just master what you have. And then when you get that new tech, you can actually get the most out of it. And then sometimes upgrades are actually downgrades.(...) Because it was saying, yeah, because the marketing doesn't really do it justice or they, they overhype whatever it is. It doesn't live up to what it's supposed to be. It can probably also fuck up your skills a little bit. Yeah. You know, if you got some ground skills and now you got something that's whatever, you know, compensating for, you know, this or that. Well, now you're going to lose that skill that you once had because you got something compensated for it. Or some people will eat shit on their new bike. Yeah. That's a real common too. Or you could probably fuck up, right? Like trying to do the same technique. Yeah. It's one of those things where you try a new machine. You know, when we buy a new machine,(...) personally, well, I guess me and my circle, you know, we don't want to pull that machine out on a big project. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. It's like, I got a jammer. Jammer is a small tattoo.(...) I got a jammer to do. Let me pull out this, you know, I'm going to pull out the new machine for the jammer. Because if I'm going to struggle to try to figure out what this machine is doing, I want to do it on a 20-minute tattoo. I'm not trying to do it on a six-hour session. Yeah. You know, you get it six hours in a session.(...) You want to know, you know, you want all your tools to be doing what they're supposed to be doing. You want to just be in a zone. You don't want to be thinking about, is this tool going to be doing what I want it to be doing? Right. Yeah. Yeah. And so do you guys have, like I know, like barbers and hairstylists, like they have a mannequin head to work on. Like, do you guys have like some like pigskin or something? You guys have like, what you do is you get hobos. You find hobos. Oh, got you. I'm just kidding.(...) Hey, man. You find homing. That seems like the common theme with a lot of different tests. No, man. Like, really,(...) they have practiced skins and shit like that. And they act like skin-ish, you know what I'm saying? Sort of. But it's not the same thing. For instance, like when you do a tattoo, you put your hands on it and you stretch the skin out. Right. And the amount of stretch you do on a 20 year old is different than you do on a 60 year old. Yeah. Well, like that, that practice skin doesn't teach you anything about that. It doesn't teach you which directions you need to stretch in when you're trying to do lines in a certain way. So it kind of gives you the feel of a machine and what it, you know, what it's like to put it to something. But it's not like tattooing. Yeah. And then you got like scar tissue. Oh, yeah. You don't work something too long. You fuck up that skin. Yeah. And it's kind of a, it's a small window. It's like you're, if you don't work the pigment enough in the skin, then you have what we call holidays, which means like little gaps that the color is not in. You know, and everybody has it on tattoos. If you have a deep or an average tattoo, it probably has holidays in it. You know, you don't have to work it until that holiday or till you get that color in. But once it's in,(...) like you don't have much time, you can't spend that much time in the skin after that because it will start chewing it up. Yeah. And that's how you get scar tissue. That's crazy. It's a small window. Yeah. You're working, you're working. Now you got to get the fuck out of that skin. Otherwise, good luck. And if it doesn't happen, like if you're, if you have a pigment that's a little difficult or someone's skin is not taking it as nice or quickly as the other ones,(...) you literally just have to stop. You're like, you know, I tried getting this in and it's not quite in there. And I personally tell my clients like, look, dude, this color is kind of a difficult one. We're going to have you come back in three weeks and I'll just reapply another layer of it and call it a day. Yeah. And most of my clients totally chill. You know, hell yeah. I'll come back in three weeks. They love coming back because it's, you know, tattoo shops a vibe. Yeah. It's not like going into Target. You know, yeah. No. Yeah, definitely. Not say Target don't have a vibe. Yeah. No, no. I guess I've never really thought about it that way. Right. Like it, uh, because every discipline has its culture. For sure. And I'm curious what the vibe is. Like I have tattoos, right? But I did go to the tattoo shop. Right. Um, but at the same time, it's also like, I'm curious what that atmosphere is like. Great. And I'm pretty sure it varies from shop to shop. So how long have you been doing tattoos? I've been tattooing since oh,(...) nine. I started tattooing in oh eight, but I just said that fucking weird. So I started professionally tattooing in oh nine, but an oh eight is when I started apprenticing. That makes sense. So, um, and I started tattooing or started apprenticing at a little shop, uh, called the ink spot on, on the west side, one 51 and 90 right where they connect. Okay. There's a shop there now. Um, heart of Texas. Shout out to Vince. You Vince Cardenas, you know, Yeah, yeah. Nugget. Yeah. So I tattooed. Yeah. There used to be a shop before Vince was in that place. Yeah. Anyway. So after like months of going to shops and taking on my drawings and getting shut down and you know, them telling me to take a fucking hike, you know, cause that's what it's like.(...) Um,(...) they said, yeah, they're like, dude, you paint. I'm like, yeah, I paint a little bit and they're like, teach us how to paint. We'll teach you how to tattoo.(...) So I kept on showing up and,(...) uh, I was there five days a week for six months, at least something like that after work, at a full time job.(...) And, uh, I was working at Harley Davidson and I leave Harley go straight to, uh, to the tattoo shop and stay there until they were pretty much closed. And, uh, yeah, that's, that's what type of painting you need. Like on canvas. Okay. Yeah. Just acrylic painting on canvases or whatever. It didn't. Yeah. Um, so yeah, you know, I went in there and started teaching them a little bit about painting and they were teaching me a little about tattooing. And, um, after being there for a few months, they're like, well, get a tattoo machine and me not knowing anything about it.(...) I went on eBay and got a kit, which is like what you're not supposed to fucking do, but the dudes that were also teaching me in my defense, didn't really give me a proper apprenticeship. It was more like show up, dude, we'll teach you whatever the fuck we, you know, to have to show you for the day type of shit. And most of the time I just showed up and cleaned up and it wasn't like, you know, there was no, uh,(...) uh, there wasn't a format, you know, there wasn't like, okay, here's, here's, we're going to do week one. This is where we're going to do nothing like that. It's just like show up. Yeah. And so it was plenty of throwing out the trash and getting shit. Talk to me all day long. Cause I'm the shop bitch. And, you know, after being in the military, being a staff sergeant, that's a tough pill to swallow, dude. Yeah. When you want something bad enough, like whatever the fuck, you know, you do it. Yeah. And that's kind of good too, because it kind of like, it checks your ego a little bit, right? Big time.(...) Yeah. It's it kind of allows you to kind of feel like you're part of something again, you know, redefining yourself. Totally different culture, obviously, but still I wanted to be immersed in it for sure.(...) But it was interesting, man, because it's not like,(...) you know, there's, like I said, there's no format. So you just,(...) you could just be pissed off and be like, fuck it. I'm not going today. Yeah. And that'll be the end of your apprenticeship. Cause you know, they'll tell you, you know, you didn't show up yesterday. Yeah. So don't come back. Fuck off. And that's the end of your apprenticeship at that shop. So it's, it's difficult because you can't show any weakness. You just had to go in there every day and be like, I'm here to do it again. I'm here to, you know, try to learn whatever smidget I can pull out today. That's basically what I was trying to do. I wouldn't teach me much, but I was there to watch. Gotcha. And you can learn a whole lot by observation. Right. So, you know, I'd watch how they set up, how they tore down. I already had some bloodborne pathogen stuff that I knew because of military. Thank God. Right. Because sometimes these dudes would tear down with no gloves on. Like these are dudes that were not all of them, but a couple of dudes, you know, pretty gnarling, you know, prison tattooers type of dudes. Gotcha. Yeah.(...) So they're probably main concern was him. Cause whatever they experienced in prison, right? Yeah. It was about making money. Yeah. I was working at was about making money. It wasn't about art artistry and a lot of shops. That's what it's about. So what started you down that path? Like when did you learn? Like that's what you wanted to do in high school in high school. I was. I'd taken some art class. I can't remember what it was, but we did like a gift exchange and his teacher brought, uh, she was the, uh, you know, that you do that. What is it? Yeah. I don't know. I don't know. Yeah. One of those games. So she brought me a little acrylic set and a couple little like eight by 10 canvases and some acrylic paint started painting. And after that, um, That that's kind of what got me started as far as tattooing wise, um, or I'm sorry, painting wise as far as tattoo stuff. Like I've been drawing tattoo stuff since I can remember. Yeah. Like it was always eye catching for me. I was drawing tattoo designs and tattoo based stuff. Even before I was like, maybe I should become a tattoo or maybe I want to become a tattooer. I just really liked the design. So I would designs. So I would spend a lot of time drawing, painting, tattoo shit without the Eve without even thinking, Oh, maybe I should become a tattooer. Maybe, maybe I really liked this. I was just doing it because I loved it. It's, that's pretty fascinating that a gift to kind of put you on that. Path. I mean, you were, you were probably doing other things. Like when you were young, like you were saying you were kind of drawing. Yeah. I've been drawing since I can remember. Was and what kind of drove you down the path of like Japanese art? You remember back in the day where you would, um, you go to the, like the flea market and they have like the Chinese stars and the, yeah, I got fucking nine chucks in the garage. So it was a little bit of that, man. Um,(...) you know, I had a fascination towards like, you know, the Asian culture since fuck Bruce Lee. Yeah. So, you know, and then there was like those shitty movies, like American Ninja and like the van damme movies and shit like that. And you know, they always led towards ninjas and all that shit. And, and I mind blowing to me, you know, cause you know, we grew up in Mexican culture and you know, Texas culture, fucking Asian. And I remember like, you know, I remember like the Asian culture and the Asian culture. Yeah. And then just get that's a fucking way. Are you kidding me? So it was always mind blowing, dude. Yeah. And I mean, my brother, I don't know if you remember this, but there used to be like a little movie theater near there in the west side. Um, near the feet, Laffiesta, which is what 24th and Castro Bell or something like that. And, um, And my memories might be fucked up and we may have gone downtown, but I think it was like a 20 to 30 minute theater. Yeah. And we pay like a quarter, 50 cents and they play like three. Like Shaolin Wu Tang style movies that were like 20, 30 minutes long. Was that the Aztec theater? I don't know. Yeah. For some reason in my head, it was around that area, but maybe that's where we caught the bus and where we'd go out to. Yeah. It's strange right how like your, your memories kind of just fused together. Yeah, dude. Kind of pull them. Yeah. Yeah. Separate them. Pull them apart. Yeah. And then I'm like, I'll have a memory and then I'll bounce that off. My, my sisters or my brother are like, Hey, did this happen like this? Yeah. And sometimes it's like, yeah. Like, no, dude, you're fucking making shit. I'm like, dude, that's how I remember. I don't know why I remember it that way. It's, it's like that when you're, it's perspective, right? Yeah. When you're a kid, everybody's so tall. And then when you're tall, everyone's so small. Yeah.(...) Yeah. Like, so, but yeah, man, um, I felt, I fell in love with, I fell in love with it then. Um,(...) And then, um, I was in the air force 96 to 04 and then, uh, I was on leave in Portland, uh, with my ex-wife. And we got a phone call saying that we had, that we had orders, her and I got orders to, uh, to Okinawa.(...) And they're like, well, you know, you're going to have to extend, you know, or whatever. And at that time I was getting out. Yeah. I had I'm fucking gone. So I'm, I'm like, oh, I need to ask you to come out. I was getting out. In my head, I'm fucking gone. But the opportunity came to go to Japan. When the fuck are you gonna live in Japan on somebody else's dime? Hell yeah, man. And then I knew once I was in Japan that there would be, I knew we'd go other places. So yeah, man. Went to Japan and obviously, everywhere you turn,(...) there's food dogs and shishii dogs and there's all this cool symbolism, all this esoteric symbols. That was philosophy. Yeah, and man, it was cool to live there every day. I'm in Japan, I don't think there was a day I didn't appreciate it. The smells,(...) like two, three miles from a beach constantly. So I'm always at the beach, fantastic. I didn't get to have only been passing through Japan. I still wanna go, because for you, like I was influenced by Asian culture. Growing up, fucking, like I said, I got nunchucks in the garage. Took different martial arts along the way and stuff. And I've always had a fascination. I have all of Bruce Lee's fucking movies still over here. I haven't watched them in a while, but after this. But even like Taoism, Confucianism, Buddhism, all those different things, I'm pretty fascinated by the philosophies of it. And I kind of take some of those ideas and kind of apply them to my life, and kind of take a little bit of everything, to try to grow and understand and lead this fucking crazy world around.(...) But I think it's cool that you had that mindset to, because I found it, I don't know if this is for you, but I had, for a while, like I was struggling. And I think it's like trying to let go, and I didn't realize at the time, and it still took a while, but trying to let go of what I thought I was connected to, and not leaving the neighborhood, right? And it was just like wanting to get out and go back home, because I felt like that's where I belonged or whatever, and there was that attachment.(...) But I think it was cool for you to kind of have that, that mindset, right? You'd be like, you know what? When am I gonna go to fucking Japan again? I suppose it'd be like, I'm getting out, I'm gonna go back home or whatever. And I'm not trying to put my thoughts in your head, but I wonder if you struggled with that, being homesick or what have you. It was, you know, obviously, being born on the West side, raised on the West side, hardly ever left the West side type of shit, right? It was like,(...) the idea of joining the military was scary, obviously, right? Because you hear all this shit, you see all this shit, and the military people get blown up all the fucking time, unfortunately. So there was that fear, but yeah, the simple fear of leaving the hood, you know what I'm saying?(...) But it did not supersede my curiosity of wanting to see what else was out there.(...) And I felt like the most, the people that I didn't like in the hood were the people that didn't leave the hood. You know what I'm saying? Whenever you talk to someone and they're like, "Oh yeah, fucking,(...) we took the bus to Nordstrom, "oh, no, I only go to the river center, bro." And it's like, "Oh, I don't fuck with this dude." I wanna talk to people that know something outside of this little circle type of thing. It wasn't conscious. I knew in my brain, I didn't like that conversation. People that were just kinda stuck, I didn't like that. Yeah, it was like that tribal, like this is, I'm only gonna stick to this. For sure. And I still run into that sometimes. And the idea, right? I've talked about this before,(...) never change. You fucking change, bro, or whatever. Change is good. But at one point in time, I allowed that to kind of-- Permeate. Yeah, and then kind of restrict me. And then after a while, it kinda hurt, right? For sure. And it was just like, after a while, I was like, "No, fucking change is good." Like, we are nature, right? Nature is always changing, right? And that's the only way you grow. If you stop growing, you're dying. Yep, impermanence is what the Buddhists call it, right? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, man, it's interesting, because we all try to avoid change. And I find myself doing it too. You end up stuck. It's like, why are we so scared of change, right?(...) And because obviously there's only growth that comes from a change. And you're either growing, I guess, in a negative way, or you're growing in a positive way. Hopefully it's a positive way. Right. But being stuck in a mode,(...) in essence, is, I don't know, man, isn't that your coffin? Isn't that your first no in your coffin? Yeah. Just saying,"All right, this is who I am, bro. "You know, going back, bro, this is who I am."(...) Like, what? That's it? So that's all there is to it? I know, dude, and to use your own, but I have said this, I don't know if I said this on the podcast, but I used to say stupid shit when it came to drinking, right? And I think it was an adopted idea, and going back to influence, it's amazing, what we listen to eat, all these things that we consume visually,(...) whatever,(...) we become, right? And I used to, I adopted this, I don't even know where I got this idea from, maybe one of my Tios or something, but if anybody ever made me stop drinking, I'd fucking leave them. I used to say that to my wife, but not add her, but it's like, and I thought that, and I was like, and I think back then, I'm like, "What the fuck are we not talking about?" That didn't even make any sense, dude. But I don't know, dude. Yeah. You know, it's funny because we grew up in a,(...) here in San Antonio, in Texas, we're drinking culture. Yeah. You live for the weekend. If you don't live for that night, you're living for the weekend. To get fucked up Friday and Saturday night, and then hopefully Sunday, if you still got the hair of the dog in you, right? Of course you do it during the week, a little bit too.(...) I don't know, man. We all get sucked into it. When I was in the band, tearing it up.(...) From 04 to 07 or 08,(...) fucking tearing it up, bro. Which is kind of good for,(...) in some instances, I hate to say that, as weird as it sounds, a little bit of alcohol kind of helps with songwriting. But getting a 12 pack in and being four in the morning, I'm not writing any fucking songs. You know what I'm saying? I'm just fucked up. Which most people are. To try to evolve from that drinking culture is tough.(...) To try to break that mode. And I'm still working on it. Yeah, there's points in my life where I'm pretty sure I was alcoholic. Yeah. And if,(...) maybe I am now. I don't know. I do know that I want to drink. I do like to drink every fucking day if I can, but I know that it's not good for me, so I chill. But it's like, I want a little buzz. What's wrong with that, right? And that's how it starts. One beer ends up being three beers, and there you go. Yeah, and in a way, am I saying it from a judgmental standpoint? But it's also an understanding and an awareness. When I had to make a conscious decision,(...) all right, I'm gonna put this to the side and figure out what's going on, because I don't know what's what, right? So when you're troubleshooting with anything, it's like, all right, let's take away from it and figure out what the baseline is. And it was interesting how that path led me on an awareness to understand and kind of look back at myself and my actions and everything to that point,(...) that I started to understand,(...) man, I thought I loved this thing, not alcohol, but like the Cowboys, right? We grew up with the Cowboys, fucking beyond deployments, whoever,(...) and I would fucking be up, fucking tired at work the next day, because I'm trying to watch the game. My wife and I would get in arguments over the Cowboys. Not over the Cowboys, but they would lose, and I'd be pissed for like a week. I wouldn't even fucking watch TV.(...) And it like consumed me, dude. And I wasn't aware of it because I was in the cycle. But when I put drinking to the side, first weekend the Cowboys played, right? I lit the grill up. And in my mind, like, I think I just conditioned myself to, like I wanted to hear the X, you know? Where when I liked the grill, the smell, and then I watched the game and I was like, it's not the same. And then I realized within like a few games that it wasn't the Cowboys I loved, it was the drinking, then the ritual I created around drinking. And then that kind of started to help me understand. And like, I don't even watch the Cowboys anymore. I haven't like five seasons.(...) But again, I don't, I'm not saying for just because I had a lot of good times drinking, had some bad times, but at the same time, and it helped me bond and things, but it's what, and I've come to understand like with anything, whether it be smoking, whatever, the difference, and I read this in a book, the difference between a drug and a poison, a medicine and a poison is a dosage.(...) So it's like trying to reestablish that relationship with whatever it is. Right. Pharmaceuticals like nowadays, like even though it's prescribed, people abuse the shit out of that. Yeah, for sure. And either way, I guess I stay from the standpoint of understanding, right? And each person has their own path and wherever they, when they make the decision, whatever the case may be, they may, that's part of it, right? Right.(...) Yeah, for me, it's an everyday decision. I get home and I decide whether I want to drink or not. Yeah. And I know one beer usually becomes two. So in my mind, I'm thinking to myself, do I want to have two beers or not? So when I equate it that way, it's easier for me to say no, because sometimes that second beer becomes a third. And for me personally, I usually go past, I don't usually go past three beers lately. But so it's easier for me when I think about it that way. Do I want to have two or three beers? Yeah. Or do I not want to drink at all? Because I never have one, who has one? Yeah. Right? So, and lately that's been my, how I kind of laid out. And I try to make that decision as I'm turning my car off and walking in my house. And it kind of trails back to the type of day I've had. Have I had a great day? That doesn't mean I run to my beer, but sometimes I've had a great day. I'm like, do you don't want a fucking beer? Yeah.(...) That's cool. And sometimes I've had a drag ass day. And it's like, you know what? If I have that one beer, I'm gonna have three, and I'm not gonna feel any better. Yeah. So it's just kind of funny that way, yeah. Yeah, and it's just understanding that relationship rate and like understanding, because I even, so I stopped drinking, and I have a drink every once in a while. Like I went to a retirement, my buddy's retirement in Las Vegas, and he rented a suite and the whole thing. So through the retirement party, he had like a fancy tequila, right? And that wasn't one of my drinks of choice, right? A little bit of some tequila with some water, some ice.(...) But I had a shot and I just kind of sit there, right? I was that dude, right? But at the same time, and like I did it, you know? And then like, it's because I understand where it's at with it, what my relationship is with it. But also it's,(...) yeah, it's to each person's like path and what they, and is it affecting their life, right? In a negative way when they drink. So, I mean, obviously health-wise, there's a lot of studies that have come out about alcohol and the human body and all these things. But it's with anything.(...) And one of the things that I started doing when I got out was like, and I never used to smoke weed at all. But one of the things I did do, especially like when I was trying to wean myself off a farm, like anti-depressant, like anti-psychotics and all those things that the VA put me on, or inpatient, VA. And it was just like, after a while, I was like,(...) where the fuck is my baseline? You know what I mean? Like, I can't feel anything. I couldn't feel anything beforehand. But now I've been on these pills for like five, six years. Like, where am I? Where do I exist? Like, I don't know what's up or down emotionally. And then, I started to think about, and then trying to work with the VA and trying to get off of them, they didn't want to help me get off of them. And I know that's per doctorate, but this one doc, I told her like, either I fucking do it with you or without you. So, you know. We gotta figure this out. Yeah, I gotta figure this out. So long story short, I had to do it on my own. It sucked, but at the same time, what I used, and I don't recommend this to everyone because weed's not for everyone, especially if like psychosis in your family and that can cause a whole different chain of events, which are not good.(...) But I use that to taper off. And every once in a while, I'll like, a little one just to kind of ease. But then I started to understand, especially like when I first started, I started to use the same habits, like with alcohol. I had a bad day or going into a social setting. I started to use it as a crutch. And then that, I didn't like that. For me personally, I didn't like that. I was like, fuck man, I don't want it to depend on this one thing to have to be like, like what if I don't have it? What am I gonna do? You know what I mean? So I started to reestablish myself with that and kind of, I don't want to say get power over it. Because I do feel like even though people will say this, but they will say like, weed's not addictive. But I think it is because you start to chase it. It's the dopamine that you're getting addicted to, right? Or like that good feeling like, oh, you know, I can, because I've heard people, especially young kids nowadays, like I need this to work, I need this to this. And I'm like, well, what do you even have? What are you gonna do? You know what I mean? So at some point we have to find our own autonomy.(...) And then like I said earlier, everyone's path is different, but. Yeah,(...) see I've never, at this point, I haven't seen any VA doctors yet or anything like that. But from what I do understand that they do have, you know, it's kind of the American prescription style of treating patients or whatever. And yeah, man, that's a tough one, dude, because no doctor's gonna be all right with saying, all right, we'll stop taking my pills, start smoking some weed, let's see what happens, you know? Because it's reckless to them, right? It's so fucking scary. And it's probably because they don't smoke weed. Yeah, and I asked them like, too, like what is yours?(...) Because there was research that was coming out or for CBD,(...) like cannabis or what have you. And they didn't even want to have the conversation, or at least she didn't want to have the conversation. Yeah, for sure. And you could tell like they were restricted by,(...) all she said was like, there's not enough sufficient evidence to cover it. And that may be true. And is it that, or is it that she hasn't looked up the sufficient evidence? Because there's a lot of fucking evidence out there saying that it helps people. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, and that's true too, because I'm finding that like, so my wife, it's the whole thing, but she has been going to school for like Chinese medicine, and she's working on the board exam, so acupuncture, and that's a lot of things to sustain me. So kind of going back to Asian culture, right? But either way, that has maintained me for a while and allowed me to maintain myself.(...) Like with pain and all that kinds of stuff.(...) But I am learning through her as well as other physicians, whether in Chinese medicine or acupuncture, or other like PCMs or anything that I talk to, have conversations with, there's a lot of that. Like I got my degree now, now I don't have to do any continuous learning. Yeah, it's like what? Yeah. What? Like I learned a tattoo in 09, so I didn't learn anything else from that. Like what the fuck is that? You don't wanna be a better doctor? Like come on, dude, like the research is always going on. So did your life end that, when you walked your stage and got your degree, come on. It's kind of irresponsible. Yeah. And I can totally relate with that, like on marijuana, because when I got out, I wanna say the first day I was home, I smoked. I overdosed totally, and it fucked me up. And I didn't smoke for two, three, actually longer than that. I didn't smoke for a long time because of that. And I just thought to myself, weed's just too strong now or whatever. And when I say overdose, I just smoke too much weed and with the homies or whatever, ended up falling asleep on the couch type of thing. I wasn't in the fucking hospital. Like that doesn't happen when you overdose on weed, when you smoke too much weed. You literally just get a headache and fall asleep somewhere.(...) So I was turned off to it. And like in high school, of course we smoked, so I was like on buddy. Me and the homies, we were, not daily, but we lived. Whenever you got it. It was fun, dude. And it's high school. So, and then, obviously after joining the military, all that shit stopped. I didn't touch it once. And I knew people I would come home and smoke weed or whatever, but I was in to me, I was gonna be in until I was out. So it didn't make sense to me. And so after I got out, like I said, the day I came home, I smoked, you got fucked up. And then I knew I had to search for a job. So I stopped. That was the only time that I smoked. And then as things kind of moved on forward, I became a tattooer and I realized, I can do this again. And a smoke shop happened to open up next to us. And the owners were extremely educated. They gave me confidence to say, like, all right, I wanna try this again. And dude, I was like, I'm shook, bro. Cause I know like the weed from today is not the same weed from 20 years ago, right? It's not your grandparents weed. Fuck no, man, it's fire, right? So anyway, I was,(...) you know, I started going in there into smoke shop and started asking questions. And then this led to another. And then, you know, I decided to get me a little pipe and smoke a little. And then, you know, I remembered, oh yeah, this is what it did. This is what it did for me. And since then, I haven't turned that off. Yeah. What you were saying about habitually or it becomes addictive. I agree with you there for the most part, but I believe it's because,(...) I don't know if people actually get addicted cause there's no chemical composition, but I believe that we become so ingrained in our habits.(...) Like we become so habitual. And that's what I mean. That it's hard to turn off. Yeah. You're like, bro, I'm used to walking in and lighting one up. And if you do that for a year, it's gonna be really hard. It's, you know, day one from the next, you know, you're like, all right, today I'm not gonna smoke. It's like, bro, you did it every day when you walked in your house. It's your habit. Right. And it's a hard habit to break. And I feel again, that it's not addictive because I personally, when like, when I decide that I'm gonna quit, I'll quit for a while. You know what I'm saying? Like, I'm not gonna smoke for a week. And yeah, do I get the urge in that week? Of course. And then I'll decide, maybe I'll see if I wait another day. Yeah. And then that becomes a week. And then after a week or so, I'm like, okay, I'm good. Yeah. You know, bring my tolerance down(...) and then going,(...) getting a little bag of wheat. No, that's fair. That's a great point. And it's not like, I guess I should clarify. It's not, I didn't mean like clinical addiction. Right, right, right. I'm sure. Yeah, yeah. Habitual though, yeah, definitely. I'm strongly a bitch, you know, probably. I'll say this, that like, I mostly go and smoke, crack the garage, right? And then, you know, just toke a little bowl or whatever, right, I have to put the kids to bed or whatever. And even when I run out, put the kids to bed, I go back into the garage. And I'll just kind of sit in my garage and,(...) we work out in the garage, me and my wife and stuff. So, you know, I'll sit around in the garage, look around, arrange something, come back in the house. I'm just so used to going into the garage to smoke. So I walk in there and I don't even have to smoke, but it's part of my habit. So I'll fuck around in there and come back out. And obviously I don't feel like I smoked, but I still kind of fulfilled my habit of walking out into the garage to whatever, you know, to exist or whatever. No, yeah, definitely. And it's beneficial in many levels.(...) I'm not a fan of vape.(...) It has like a gross feeling for me. Right. I mean, too. You talking about CBD vapes or tobacco vapes or? No, just vapes. Well, I haven't smoked nicotine or any type of, but more specifically, like CBD or THC vapes. I tried those in the beginning. And it's just got like a very, like, it feels like it drags me down. Like, you get the good hit or like the feeling like in the beginning, but then like the lingering, like condition-wise, like riding or anything else, working out. I feel like it drags me down. Like the, it's almost like the oil kind of gets in my lungs and it's just heavy. Yeah. But with like flour,(...) and it's like the natural way, right? Just a little bit of that. Like, and I'm talking about like a little fucking, like little pinch, right? Cause I learned, right? You know, like, cause I think initially it was like ego, like ego is like, it's kind of like with drinking, like, oh dude, I'm a fucking dude. Yeah, I'm a fucking dude. Whatever. Yeah. Ooh. But then after a while, it's like, that's not sustainable, you know? And then you get the tolerance like you spoke of, and then it gets expensive, all those things. And then factor in like me trying to change my relationship with it and understanding.(...) And I think because it made, I had an awareness that I didn't know where that line is. And it's like trying to just have my own autonomy and be self-sufficient because if I don't have that one thing, then what am I going to do? For sure. But with that, it's, do you feel,(...) like I know what it does for me is artistically, but how does that help with your drawing and, or just in general, like how, what do you, how do you get in that space for creating new art? I could draw whenever, obviously, right? You know, like I didn't, I haven't smoked this morning, but end up, you know, pull out the iPad and work, you know, for hours on it right now. So it's no, I think it's more about(...) how it helps me is helping, like in art, you learn all these rules. You gotta do this, you gotta do that in order to make composition balance, color balances, all this stuff, right? And it helps me toss the rules. Like, okay, not the fundamental rules of what makes the tattoo good, just the like, maybe I'm going to make these eyes a little bit more bug eyed on this thing, or maybe I'm going to make the hand a little bit like creepier, the nails longer, or, you know, some blood spewing out of this, or maybe this dragon have this awkward turn to it instead of like these usual stances. So it helps me just kind of take the rules down a little bit. Yeah. And then also being like a shop owner since 09, so what, four to 15 years now, you know, it working with people and working with clients, things can get a little frustrating sometimes, you know? And so it, I kind of, I think it helps with that too. Yeah. It's just like chill, little relaxation, like, you know what, this isn't really that big of a deal. Yeah, people, go ahead. I would say in between that and exercise,(...) like, those are the two biggest de-stressors in my life, you know, that's like, okay, cool, I feel a little bit more calm about this situation, you know what I'm saying? Yeah, and it's good you have those, because you needed like a balance to kind of get that excess energy out, because if not, it leads to other side, depression, anger, all these things. Yeah. What do you-- It's nice for us too at the shop at Imanikachoa. No, you're good, man. Because most of the guys at the shop,(...) at my shop, particular Smoke,(...) so it's nice to powwow, you know, because we literally, it's a powwow, right? Yeah. You know, go back thousands of years, this is the piece of the piece pipe, bro. So we're sitting around our fire, right, talking. Okay. And it'll be like, you know, the conversation's often like, bro, you know, this fucking dude came in with his, you know, the shitty dagger on his forearm, and you know, he's asking me for this fucking, like, this girl head, like, wow, the fuck am I gonna position that? You know, and as we're sitting there smoking, you know, we're having this conversation on how to problem solve art.(...) And, you know, we have a very unique relationship, like me and the homies at the shop, we've been together for a long time, and it's because of that, because the ego, like, fuck that, you know, it's like, we're not scared to push our iPad over to the next dude, or girl, and be like, yo, like, what do you think? Like, I'm having trouble with this thing, you know.(...) We're all open to criticism, you know, to positive criticism or whatever, so. And the smoking really helps that. Like I said, man, there'll be four of us in a circle, and one dude will literally have his fucking,(...) you know, a drawing pad out, and be like, dude, like, okay, I'm fucking, you know. Yeah, yeah. And like, it's great, you know. It helps in that sense, for sure.(...) So, ritualistic, basically where I was gonna go with it. Definitely, man, it's a kind of staff meeting, and I would like to be part of it, you know what I mean? Right, you know? Safety. Yeah, and that's kind of opposite, right? I've kind of worked in corporate type of meetings and stuff like that, like in the Air Force, and Tuesday, they have their place, but a lot of times you would struggle with ego,(...) people with their pet projects, and stuff like that. Or like, they were out in the military, but they still had their rank on them, you know what I mean? Yeah, oh yeah. It's just like, so, either way,(...) to have that type of collaboration, right? And like, low ego, best product forward, best for the customer, it's not about me. That's great, man. Yeah, it's organic, you know.(...) Of many levels. It is, man, it is, it really is. And you know, they,(...) like one of the guys, one of the, my brother, this dude, Butter,(...) shout out Butter, he's a ridiculously dope artist. He goes to, as a matter of fact, he flew out this morning to a Native American ritual, like not the ayahuasca, the pied deyote. Yeah, it's a-- The moon, one of the moon phase,(...) they do it four times a year, hopefully I'm not fucking this out, but it's like four times a year, and when the moon hits a different phase, they go out there and do like a ceremony(...) with their medicine, their priority medicine. And so it's nice having someone that's so knowledgeable and seasoned and experienced in these types of things, because it makes me, I'm more open, because he speaks of MDMA, DMT, that type of thing. And so it's like, all right, I don't have a reason to be scared. I have a source of information, and someone that's done it personally, they can tell me, not that he's a guide or whatever, but he's definitely someone that I can, he's a good resource for information to calm myself type of thing.(...) Yeah,(...) man, it's kind of cool being in a circle, working within an industry in which we don't have those limitations where, if anybody comes in or in their rank, they'll get fucked off so fast. And what are you doing, dude? Go on, go on. What is this? I had issues with that. I had issues with that, like getting out of the military and then whatever it was, four or five years later, opening a business. I had people that worked for me, and that's what I would say, oh yeah, yeah, I got these guys working for me. And that mentality was fucked for me. It changed to who I work with, because we're all this, we're a body. We're like a more Voltron, dude. We can't be a Voltron unless all the pieces kind of jump in. So yeah,(...) the ego can jump in sometimes. Yeah, and it does, it does for me too. I took myself pretty serious at 1.2 because, I don't know, there's a place for that, right? And I try to-- You need that sometimes. Yeah, you need that sometimes, especially when you have knuckleheads. But at the same time, it's like, it doesn't, I think Ram Dass talks about how, I don't think he does talk about wearing suits. There's all these different suits that you wear, like you're someone different with your wife than you are with your friends and family. So all these rows, right? So you put that suit on. And it's understanding where, when to take that suit out of the closet for the appropriate situation, right? I need to be a father now. I need to be a husband now. But we just do it unknowingly. But if you can consciously do it, now I think that's where a lot of men in particular struggle with the idea of healing, because they think once I accept this idea of, like, I'm gonna be weak, but you can be both, right? There's a time to be vulnerable. There's a time to be strong. There's a time to be this. You can be all those things, those are various points. So yeah, and that's good that, yeah. Like one, it's like the awareness, right? And then two, it's like, all right, I'm aware. I gotta educate myself. And then three, I gotta take action. I gotta practice. Yeah, yeah, and it's practice, right? It's a skill. All these things are skills and nobody learns them overnight, but it's having conversations like this, which is important. And that's good because it makes you a better leader and it makes you a better friend and all these things, right? And people can come to you, because with people, people have problems, right? And you can't best help your team if you don't understand who they are as a person at the very basis. Yeah, for sure. What do you think ideas come from? Who knows, dude? I don't fucking know. That, who, I was talking to somebody about that. It's like, I think ideas, I think part of it is obviously influence, like what you're looking at, right? What you eat, drink, and consume.(...) But I also think, obviously, past experiences is a huge thing. Yeah. But who knows? Where else do they come from? How does the universe,(...) I don't know. It's strange because every once in a while, you come up with this really dope idea and most of the time, I don't think it came from me.(...) It's like, no, somebody else. This came from something else.(...) Somebody did this before me that did it better than me. Yeah. Like, you know, so it's, I don't know. Like, I don't know. You tell me where the ideas come from. There's a couple of different theories and I think that's part of it, right? But I think there's like a, have you ever heard of Akashic Records? Vaguely. So it's, just think of it as like the universe is, like the universe consciousness. Okay. Like these ideas are kind of floating around the ether and we're in that vibration of syncopate, like come in. I think that's why a lot of people have the same idea at the same time or like, like think of comedians, right? Like, hey, that dude stole my line. And that could be true. But how the situation is observable by everyone, right? And somebody in that craft will see the same situation and it's pretty damn likely if you're thinking of breaking up, putting a bit together, then you're going to like, probably think about it in the same way, right? Because there's only so many ways that you can put that bit together. Unless it's a personal experience that you're pulling from and then that's something else, right?(...) But yeah, I mean, it's just this database of information that always exists through time, that energy doesn't die, right? It just kind of change forms and I feel like that's one of the places. You have to be in the right mindset too, for good ideas. You know, it's rare that I'm like, you know, I don't think you can be sitting there with your, you know,(...) fucking stank mind. You know, I'd be sitting there like, oh fuck this, blah, blah, blah, blah, and then you're going to get like some dope idea all of a sudden. Like, I think you really have to have the right mindset. And I'll tell you what, you're driving a car, I drive 40 minutes, you know, 45 minutes from burning to San Antonio every day. And, you know, some thoughts happen. Yep. You know what I mean? Being in a warm shower, thoughts happen. Being in a fucking car by yourself, thoughts happen. And sometimes shit just like subconsciously happens, I think, like in a sense of, I'll wake up and have, you know, you wake up, you have a song in your head, same shit, right? I have an idea, you know, it's like, man, was I thinking about this while I was kind of, kind of falling asleep or was I dreaming about this? But I got this idea, you know, so.(...) So those are good, driving is a good one, especially like if I'm trying to process something, like I just kind of, you know, let it kind of flow out. But I noticed that a lot of ideas come right before I'm about to go to sleep.(...) It's just like, and some, most of the time, I'm too lazy to get up and write it down, but. Bro,(...) Tesla, Nikola Tesla, used to sleep like in a chair like this, right? Yeah. And on his writing hand, I don't know, left or right, I'm assuming this right hand, he had a pen and a pencil,(...) I'm sorry, pencil and a pad or whatever. And on his left hand, he would keep basically ball bearings or like stones or something, and a metal bowl underneath the stones, and he would sit there for his nap. And right when he'd start falling asleep, going into that weird. Yeah, the theta state. What is it called? I think it's theta. Theta, so right when you go into that,(...) your hand relaxes, the stone would drop, it'd wake him up, and what thoughts he was having, he'd immediately go to write. Oh wow. And I think that's such a fucking cool practice. I don't know how long he did it for or whatever, but I'm like, fuck dude, because I've had some, what I thought were pretty profound ideas, and you wake up and they flee. And you're like, what in the shit, right? And this is gonna be a weird one, but I was telling my wife this one the other day. Go for it. I was having, I had one of those the other day,(...) and it's gonna sound completely stupid, but the only thing I remember was, it was, I was remembering, I was thinking about a new design for a shovel, and it was like a shovel handle,(...) and in my thetos? I think it was theta. Theta, mind state, it was just weird. I don't know whether I was designing a new shovel handle or what, but in my mind state it was golden too. It was like a gold handle for some reason. Of course some decoration has to be thrown in there. Right, right. In your word, thoughts, yeah. But, and I don't know whether it was the hand positions or the length of the shovel or what was different about the shovel, but I went into a whole different shovel design, and I woke up and I was thinking, I had it in my head for about two minutes, and then it totally split, but it made sense for two minutes. I wonder if like afterwards I could draw it, because then when you're talking about it, I used to do a lot of shoveling in the military, and as you sit there, you have to fucking shovel the shit out of stuff.(...) Dude, especially-- I was a shovel engineer, plumber, dude. Oh, okay. So I spent a little bit of time shoveling. I was a cable dog. Yeah, so we were always digging trenches and shit. But in my mind I saw like, obviously a shovel was very straight, and then the, so the handle would be here, the handle would be here, and it would do this, and then out, so you can grab it. And I don't know if that's what you saw, but not on the fucking now. Either way. But you know, it's just an example of how, you know, Nikolai, right? Like if I could have written it down or drawn it on the spot, I would have done that, because it was mind blowing at that time. I had another buddy that said that he, you know, like the baby bottles,(...) straight baby bottle laid on its side, right? Okay, well now grab that same baby bottle if I can break it off in a 45. They have those baby bottles that tilt up, right? So that like the milk goes down to the baby, and they have to have a buddy of mine said when he was like five years old or something, he's my age, so this is like 45 years ago almost, which I said that he woke up one day and had that thought. Like how come baby bottles aren't twisted up? Because he had a little brother at the time, and I guess he would have to help his little brother tilt the bottle up and probably pissed him off, right, you're a little kid, and fuck with his little thing, right? And so he asked his mom, how come they don't have baby bottles that tilt? And of course she was just like, shut up, man, you have your fours, shut up, fuck up. I got time for this shit. I got time for your brother's crying, right? And he said like maybe 10 years down the line or five years down the line, he goes to, they go to the grocery store, Walmart or where the fuck, and he sees these tilted bottles, and he looks over at his mom and he's like, do you remember when I asked you all these? And she's like, I do. She gave him props for it, right? But again, one of those things, he's like, bro, I could have been, I could have been a billionaire right now, like maybe, maybe. And if you think as you were talking about that, I was thinking about like the, I don't know if all the tribes did it, but like Native Americans were, they had the water, I don't know if it was like bison, I'm probably fucking this up, but like it was leather, right? But it was in a, like a U, I don't wanna say, like a V shape. So that would make sense, right? And like I remember, like in my mind, I could see it was like a strap on, hanging on their side or whatever. But yeah, it's very practical, right? As opposed to this, like, I don't know, we wanna put things in straight lines sometimes. Yeah, yeah, I mean, it would make more sense than a fucking 60 ounce Yeti that you paid $200 for. Yeah, right? That shit is crazy to me, right? When I walk in a, you know, the fucking Academy(...) and they got like these, I don't know, $800 coolers that are pink. What are we doing, dude? Don't you just need to put meat in that fucking thing and keep it cold? Yeah. I don't know. And those things don't even stay as cool as like some of the Coleman like, The old school ones, right? So when I was stationed in New Mexico, my first station, I was a-- Where were you in New Mexico? In Alamogordo. Okay. What is that? Holloman, Holloman. Holloman, yeah. F-117. Yeah. So I was working with a civil engineer and I needed to get some shit signed off. So they put me in like exterior plumbing with a civilian, old dude named Bill. Okay. And I would watch Bill pour a whole fucking coffee cup or a whole, you know, coffee mug or whatever, container into like this big ass thermos. We'd go and do our jobs, dude. I'm telling you at noon, when you would open that thing up for some more coffee, it would still be smoking. Damn. You know, we're talking four hours later, bro. Yeah. Old Coleman, you know, with the metal handle that you know, like your, your wellito hat, you know, your grandfather hat, right? And that's all you need. Yeah. It's all you need, you know. I remember like older generations always saying like, hey, I'm gonna make them like they used to, but that's true. It's true, dude. Yeah, cause that's like, I'm,(...) I forgot what the actual term is, but there's a model for like making things not last as long.(...) And-- Absolutely, what is it? Like programmed obsolescence or something like that. Yeah, something like that. Designed obsolescence, or designed to die at a certain time. Right. iPads and whatever the fuck, everything technology based right now, man.(...) Isn't it crazy? Yeah, it is crazy. But when you have a society that's like,(...) well, financially that's based off of just, you know, making money, then everything goes backwards. Yeah, I mean, and to think of everybody built things designed to last,(...) how much,(...) I think our society would be better. Yeah. Cause we would spend money on things that we actually, need instead of saying, oh, I need, you know, I want a new phone, I want a new phone. If you're saying that every two years, dude. Yeah. How much is the phone now? 1500 bucks? Yeah. That's crazy. It's ridiculous, man. That's crazy. Shit, fucking eggs are like-- My first car was $600. That's crazy. For an escort, like a wagon. Yeah. Yeah, the stereo I put in it was $600, so. Dang, so it's $200.(...)$200 I had invested in my-- Yeah, you go, man. It was like a wagon, bro. Did you have bumps in there? You know I had bumps in there. Like two 12s in a fucking way. That bitch gonna rattle apart. Hell yeah, dude, like the door's gonna fall off. I sold it to an ex-girlfriend. Yeah. As a matter of fact, yeah. Stereo had to come out though. Yeah, of course, dude. And you gotta put in the new car. Absolutely. Yeah. So what was that journey like? You went from an apprentice to the idea of owning your own shop. So I always wanted to own my own business. And after I joined the military, I feel like I started gaining a bigger understanding of the world, right? I wanted to do bigger things. Because I wasn't just no longer stuck in my neighborhood, right? So to me, it was like,(...) I felt, I still feel this way, but I felt stronger that I could do whatever the fuck I wanted. So I wanted to own my own business. To me, in my brain, the only way to get ahead was to own my own business. So at some point, I felt like I was gonna do that in my life. I didn't know that it was gonna be with tattooing, honestly. I didn't know what it was gonna be in. I thought it was gonna be for some reason, in music, I was looking to make my own label or something like that. After being in a band for seven years or so, different bands,(...) it was my passion. You know, music is right up there with drawing.(...) So after the apprenticeship, what happened? I remember, okay, so I was working at Harley Davidson, and doing my apprenticeship. And at the time I had a girlfriend, she also worked at Harley Davidson. She was one of the managers.(...) And I was right at the end of my apprenticeship, pretty much, where they were letting me do walk-in tattoos, not hard ones, just really basic ones. And I was at work one day, and they kind of walked, man, you know, the store GM walks in, and he's like, "Well, we all know about you "and you're the girlfriend." And I'm like, "All right, so what's up?" And he's like, "Well, either you can quit or she can quit, "but y'all both can't work here." And it was an issue with me being a salesperson and her being a finance person.(...) And obviously she was probably, at that time, finance people make a lot of fucking money, the car business, or whatever. So she was making, I don't know, a lot of money. And I know what I was making, but it wasn't what she was making. So it only made sense for me to quit, which is kind of dumb, but whatever. I was like, "All right, you know what? "Now's the time to go."(...) I had saved up a couple bucks, and her and I kind of conjured like,"Hey, let's open up a tattoo shop." And through drunken conversations with her friends, we kind of planned it one night, I think at a Sushi Zushi, actually. We're sitting there having sushi one night, and it's like, "You know what? "Let's do this." So we're sitting with a couple girls that did hair. They're heavily tattooed, and they were in this, the vibe, right? And they were kind of complaining about where they were working at. So in one night, we conjured up, opened up a tattoo shop that also had this alternative feeling style salon on the other side of it.(...) So when we first opened up our shop, it was just that. You'd walk in, we had a front desk, and then you either went over and got a haircut, or you went and got the tattoo type of shit. Yeah.(...) Anyway,(...) so when I opened up the shop, I didn't have much skill. My idea was I'm gonna hire dudes that have skills, and I'm gonna take, I'm gonna learn from them, and I'm gonna take on the type of work that I can take on. So I wanted to kind of like baby step my way into being a full-time tattooer. And that's pretty much how it worked out, with the exception of everything's going good, we've got six, eight months in, the shop's doing all right.(...) And then all of a sudden,(...) the hair people decided, "Eh, maybe I'm gonna go back to my old salon," because things were safer over there. And I'm not sure if that's what the thought was, but that's kind of how I saw it. And then the two tattooers that I had working for me, one asked for a ridiculous fucking raise, and I couldn't, I'm like, "I can't give you 80%, 90%, "that doesn't make sense." I'm not making anything then.(...) And then the other tattooer, I think had the sense that we were struggling, because him and his brother walked up to me, and they were like, "10 grand, and we own half the shop." And I'm like, "Take a fucking hike. "Sorry, I got more invested."(...) No. So he quit. So all of a sudden, I own a tattoo shop, and it's just me in it. Whoa. Yeah, dude. So it was kind of fucking rough. It was like maybe about three weeks, a month,(...) and it's just me tattooing every day, and then there's things coming in that are well built, like past my skill level. And thankfully, back then, I was just like, "You know what?"That's kind of not what I do." I didn't want to say that's not my skill level. I don't know what, and I think you should go here. And there was about three or four shops and people that I was referring clients to, when they were asking me for stuff that I couldn't do. And I ended up hiring this dude, Eloy Garcia. Shout out to Eloy, and he ended up being my inadvertent mentor. And we'd come in every day and talk about just fundamentals of tattooing. Like the basics, the basics, the basics. And in some way,(...) my education, my tattoo education started with him. Like my actual tattooing started sometime before that, but the history and the respect and all that. It came a little bit afterwards, which kind of backwards, but either way, I still obtained. You know that saying is like when the student is ready, the master would appear. Yeah, yeah.(...) And when Eloy walked in, man, it saved my career, I think, it saved the shop. It saved the idea of what Flesh Electric was gonna be.(...) I always wanted to be a high-end shop. I never wanted to be a turn and burn type of shop. And in my eyes, in my idea, he helped that. Like it was, because he came from a super grounded tattoo situation. Like he worked with like some of the best and in my opinion, some of the best. And then they worked with like some of, like the pillars of tattooing. Like Eloy worked with Weldon, and I believe Weldon worked with this dude, Dave Lum. Dave Lum worked with this other person, Raulo, and Raulo worked with Ed Hardy. So there was like this very five degree of separation between me and Ed Hardy or whatever. And I think that that's fucking huge. Like Eloy was huge in that sense. And anyway,(...) yeah, once I hired Eloy, to me I felt like the concrete dried.(...) It's like, okay, we're fucking, I'm doing this for fucking ever.(...) So I learned as much as I could while we worked together. We probably worked together for about three or four years maybe. Whoa. Yeah. That's pretty awesome because I've been learning through my experiences and the experiences of others. Like when,(...) it seems like when tragedy strikes, right? Or like, that's probably a bit dramatic, but it's all subjective in that experience.(...) If the people that can have the right mindset, yeah, it sucks, but start to shift, all right? Like what am I gonna do now? And start to come up with a plan and appreciate all the lessons at that time and overcome that and stick with what your intuition is telling you.(...) That's when like, all right, God, the universe is like-- Lining up. Here it is, you know? And you walk into it and then you grow from it because it's like moving a pot, right? Or a plant from a small pot to a bigger pot. It's gonna struggle, it's gonna hurt, but once you're able to grow even bigger because of it. And those people that you thought,(...) and to your own. But those two individuals or whoever that kind of left your life, they were,(...) it was really a blessing, right? To allow you to grow and be the artist that you are. Yeah, at the time, I'm freaking out. Dude, I'm used to,(...) our business motto is set up on having other people bring commission too. So I was tripping, like, fuck, is this the beginning or the end? I didn't make it a year. I'm part of that statistic that most businesses don't make it a fucking year. But those were just thoughts. Like in the sense of,(...) I always knew I was gonna make it. In the sense that I knew I'd never let go. I just keep pushing, keep pushing.(...) And that's what, you know, that's, when they left, I had no idea what I was gonna do, but I knew I was gonna keep pushing. So it was kind of like that.(...) After a while, after I hired Eloy and things started moving right in the correct direction, you know, of course I was like,(...) how did this happen? Like, God, I was so lucky because in the moment, I was shitting my pants. You know, like there was several times, dude, where the bills were due at the end of the month, the rent was due. Yeah.(...) And I'm sitting there like on a verge of tears, dog. Like, what the fuck am I gonna do? It's hard, you know? And of course, you know, it's like when you leave, when I left the military, you know, I suddenly was like, whoa, no more fucking paycheck. No more sick hall, no more fucking nothing, you know? And the first time I got sick, it was like ridiculously like strep throat almost. And you know, that type of shit. It didn't work for three days. And I'm like, fuck, I need to go to work, dude, to make some money. And so yeah, it's a very, it's, at the time it's scary, but it's a thing that only makes you stronger, right?(...) The jocko willing, good. Yeah. Like, all right, they left, good. Figure it out now. Yeah, I love jocko. Yeah, me too.(...) But yeah, it's,(...) you know, you only learn through being uncomfortable, through struggle. I mean, you can also learn without struggle, but I think the education that you receive is a bit more permeated into you when you go through struggle. Yeah, and I think the lessons learned are usually learned through, I don't wanna say, I don't know if it's like embarrassment or like pain. It's like one of those two, they're kind of, those deep lessons. They hurt the most obviously, right? Yeah, yeah. Like, I'm not doing that shit again. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's terrible, I ain't fuck. Yeah.(...) But at the same time, on the opposite end of it, right? Like, that's the path, right? That it was put in front of you. It's like, I could give up and that's the, I heard one person say it this way. It's like the loser mindset, right? It's like, nothing's going my way. And you run into those people, right? And I understand it because I used to be there at one point, like I thought things, and that's just the mindset I was in. It wasn't until going through those hard things, overcoming certain things, learning from others, that it's just like, no, like, how can I shift this? Let me just sit,(...) figure out.(...) And that's another thing. Ever seen the movie "Collateral Beauty"? No. That's what Will Smith is before the slap. But it talks about like, in the movie, he loses people he loves, or a person he loves. And it's like,(...) I think in the movie, there's supposed to be like angels or something like that, but like they're people. And it's like, you just need to like sit and appreciate the collateral beauty of it. Because in that tragedy, there's all these good things that are happening too. And I feel like it's like this, I wish I had a good way to describe it, but it's like these series of events that are kind of like constantly like, just think like a maze, right? That's always moving, right? And if you can sit in it and have the right patience and headspace and listen to the words of people trying to tell you, because there's always people like, they're trying to bring you out of it, right? In a conversation like Eloy, right? He's trying to like, hey man, try this, try that. And you could have been like, fuck that, you don't understand or whatever. But it's like, hey, it's right here in front of you. So if you can kind of see those, like in football, right? When the hole opens up,(...) you run through it or walk through it, right? But if you're not aware or paying attention, it's gonna fucking pass it. It's gonna keep passing it. It's like these things that are moving and you gotta wait for it to all and then go right through it. And they're always there, but it's just, I mean, it's hard, right? It's hard while you're going through it.(...) But I'm glad that at this point that, because,(...) and that's kind of one of the things that, for this podcast, many different things, it's a catch all. But it's sharing people's experiences and stories because it's all relative, right? And if somebody's going through whatever, whether they're a business or the military or what have you, it's like, all right, well, how did so and so do it? Or how did, and there's just these patterns and commonalities in people's stories that it's like, hey, just sit and wait and line up if it's meant to be a line up. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, it was weird, man, like, right now it's talking about the military or,(...) I had this thought about getting out. And it was getting out of the military was terrifying because I knew that in order to hook up where I needed to be after I got out, that it was gonna be one of those things where all the pieces were gonna be moving and I needed to be aware of where I needed to jump in. Right, it's like, what is it? A jump rope, right? It's like a jump rope with like fucking 40 ropes. So, you know what I mean? And I got out at what I thought was still a decent time. Like it was a old force, so the economy, like the economy crashed, didn't happen four years later. So the economy was good. Like we did, like, I think it was an okay time to get out, but it was one of the scariest things, because I went from having everything or not everything, but you know, the military-- Comfortable. Yeah, dude, you know. And having a higher rank, you know, or a decently somewhere in the middle of the ranks.(...) And, you know, getting out was like, what the fuck am I gonna do? Like, what is next? Like I literally was in the newspaper looking for jobs. Oh, gotcha. You know, like grabbing the newspaper, going into the job section. Yeah, the classifieds. The classifieds, dude. And it's back when the newspaper was still popping, right? And online jobs, you know, it was a thing, but the newspaper was still kind of reliable or whatever. Anyway, so I took a job doing this,(...) like for this pool company, and I went to the job site and realized that it was fuckery from the beginning. Like I've been on a lot of job sites and realized that this one was fucked up. And I walked off, I was there for 10 minutes, I'm like, you can't do this.(...) And I sat in my car for about 20 fucking minutes after I walked off that job site, confused. Confused, scared. I didn't know what the fuck was gonna happen. I don't know what, if I just,(...) if I hadn't made the worst mistake of my life, like I had all these thoughts, dude, like, what's happening right now? What did I do? And some regret was kicking in, you know, I'd be like, you know, I could be fucking Hawaii right now, dude, like, you know, at my next duty station. And yeah, man, it was tough. And when that job just kind of fell apart, I almost took, I pretty much took the next job that I could take, right? And that was Porter at an infinity, at a car infinity dealership, at a luxury car dealership.(...) And I didn't know what Porter meant, dude. I just know that they were hiring for a Porter, right?(...) And it said something like they're doing interviews on Monday,(...) nine o'clock show up. What is a Porter? I don't know what the fuck it is. A Porter's literally the dude that like grabs the car and drives it to the back. Oh, gotcha. He's a dude that if it rains, they mop the outside drive. It's mostly service, right?(...) So they're the do it all, right? Maybe some Porters get a lot of, get paid decent, but this particular job, it wasn't much at all. I'm talking like, I think it was like $7 an hour. So I take, so I go in for this job and I'm dressed in a suit. I was the only person dressed in a suit. Everyone else is like in long sleeve shirts and shit like that. And sitting down and having this interview, my first interview,(...) and in the interview, she was like, "You're overqualified. "Why are you sitting here right now?" And I'm like, "'Cause I need a job." And I got lucky, because she was like,"Well, you're overqualified. "You're the only person here in a suit," which like blows my mind. So we're gonna hire you, but there's gonna be an opportunity in three or four months. I can't tell you about it, but you will be qualified for that job. And we'd like to hire you for that job, but I can't tell you what it is yet. And man, going into that situation was fucking crazy, because now I'm making seven bucks an hour trying to pay for an apartment and all this shit. And no B.A.S., no B.A.H., nothing, right?(...) My wife, she got out of the military too, so we're both civilians. She's a personal trainer, and that's all hit and miss. She may train two people one day. She may train 10 the next day, who knows, right? And so yeah, I took that opportunity. And thankfully, three or four months later, they were like, "Hey, we need a service manager "or a service writer." And they offered me a job that was 80, 90, a year, which was like, "Fuck, I'll take that." Back in 04,(...) I mean, now that's good money, but back in 04, that fucking felt more like 120, 150 a year or something to me. It's like,"Fuck yeah, I'll take that." And thankfully, it was one of those things where, it's like every day showing up for $7 an hour, and having people like, there's people that are kind of, people treat you like shit when you're a reporter sometimes, and they're driving a fucking $90,000 fucking SUV, and they pull up and say shit, or kind of look at you like you're a piss hand or whatever. Takes a lot of pride to, or takes a lot to not, be like, "Fuck you, fuck this." I'm out, just get stank about it. But, stuck around and got the job, and I guess after that, my life was a lot easier in that sense where I wasn't so worried about(...) where the next dollar was gonna come from. Because that's the very first thing when you get out of the military. How am I gonna make money? Exactly. Right? So, yeah. I mean, fortunately for me,(...) I mean-- What'd you do when you got out?(...) When I got out? Yeah. I've been doing this. Yeah? Well, yeah, I mean, it was a bunch of different things.(...) Everything happened in reverse for me.(...) You did 20? Yeah, I did 20. Okay. Yeah, so I got out in 2018. Okay. I was about to get a job on base as a contractor, paying good money. I wasn't ready to go back to work. I wasn't aware of that until my wife told me, just take a break, just figure out what you wanna do.(...) So, I was just kinda grasping at straws, you know? In 17, so I retired in 18. In 17, I had an attempt. I took my... I talk about it as one of the reasons I started this podcast, kinda talk about it from a standpoint of, this is just what happened,(...) this hour I learned from it, and try to hopefully help vets or anybody else that's listening.(...) Find some similarities in the story,(...) and overcoming it, but it's never easy to talk about really, just to understand, you kinda put yourself, allow yourself to be in that position because of the ego pride, all these things, right? You put yourself before the mission, or putting the mission ahead of yourself. But with that up, growing a lot, right? We just talked about growth, comfort, and all these things.(...) But,(...) so,(...) I... On a whim, I bought a mountain bike, and I wanted nothing to do with the military at the time. I mean, I have to say this because it was a system that, and I have a different standpoint of it now, because in the podcast I've talked about it before, but I feel like it's important to highlight my leaders, that they took care of me, they looked out for me. It was a system that kind of, not talking to the VA,(...) create, trigger the med board, I mean, luckily. And so it was like a whole thing, right? It left me bitter because, I was trying to prove that I was still able to, staying past my 20, the system was trying to push me out before my 20, so that made me bitter. But luckily, the system and all this bureaucracy, I'm pretty sure people praying for me or whatever, allowed me to get past my 20.(...) So it was just this back and forth, me trying to prove to the bigger force that, hey, I can still do the job. But on the other side of it, it was like, also trying to prove to the VA that these things are going on with me, so when I get out, I get my ratings. So it was just like this fucked up place, right? Yeah, it was just balance. And it became, because at the same time, it's like you wanna leave on your own accord rate. You wanna, I've done all these things, and I like to think in my mind that nobody would've knew what was going on with me, because I pretty much turned myself in, or I was like, I'll go in and be patient. And that's when I kind of start to reassess my life and everything that I've done to that point. And so with that, I got out,(...) luckily I have the wife that I have, because she helped me through a lot of it, because she's a lot smarter than me.(...) She's been trying to glee me. I think all her wives are smarter. Yeah, yeah.(...) She lets me think I'm smart sometimes. But she's kind of like, was leaving these carrots of information, but I was, again, I wasn't paying attention, because of the mindset I was in, right? I was in the victim mentality, if you will. And so I got out, I kind of leaned on a past experience in Germany, where I was riding bikes, right? And that was fun. So grasping at straws, I was like, I need to do something, right? Yeah. I need to figure out what my next move is. And in the meantime, I'm gonna try to do something that brings me joy, right? And I wasn't drinking anymore, I wasn't kind of doing the same things that I was doing before. And it was just like, all right, well, I'll buy a mountain bike, go outside and bring activity. And that started to help me understand myself, because I started riding on my own. And it made me feel like I could do something that I could be good at again. And I didn't, and it gave me hope, right? And I started to ride, and I started to ride more, and that slowly started kind of introducing me like more to a community. And the more I tried to push away from the military aspect of it, the more I ran into people. I chose the wrong fucking city to do it in, you know what I mean? Yeah.(...) But on the other side of it, I'm grateful for it, right? Because it led me to a nonprofit that I've been working for and with, volunteering with, in the Dirt Therapy Project. And we, I got invited, actually my buddy, shout out to Sport, who passed away last night.(...) He, I was selling some mountain bike tires to him, right? On one night, and yeah, I mean, it fucking sucks, dude. Like, I think I naturally would try to push away, right? Like try to deal with whatever. But he sold me some, I was selling him some mountain bike tires, it was supposed to be like a 10 minute conversation. I told my wife, like, hey, I'll be back. I'm gonna go sell some tires that I'm not using. I met him in a Walgreens parking lot, and we ended up having like a four hour conversation or so. My wife was calling me, I didn't answer, because I like to stay engaged with whoever I'm talking to, right? Yeah. A week later, he invites me to Bentonville, Arkansas, which I didn't know where I was at. He was like, hey, buddy of mine, Jonathan, is gonna be going to Bentonville, Arkansas. We're gonna be,(...) he's trying to get some content for his page, and I was like, I don't want that. He's like, do you have a GoPro? I was like, no, I don't. I used to fucking hate taking pictures, taking videos, anything, because of the place I was at, right? I just felt like when people would go visit him in Boston, I was like, we gotta fucking keep moving. It's not safe. In my mind, that's what I was, it wasn't rational, but that's how I felt, like I had this anxiety, like we gotta fucking keep moving. Right. So it was the whole thing, right? So taking pictures out of the fucking, I was like, all fucking serious, all fucking angry and shit. So it was the whole thing,(...) but at the time, I was like, no, I don't have a GoPro, whatever, but I still went, I tried to deal with everyone on my phone. And then I was so excited and stoked about mountain biking, because of what it was starting to light up inside me. Right. I knew it was something good, I didn't know what it was. And then, so I was telling Jonathan, who's the founder, like, hey, this is kind of like my story. I think I was in this mode, especially like going to group therapy and stuff, where I was just kind of sharing too much. But at the same time, I don't regret anything because this led me to where I'm at now.(...) And I continue to do that with this podcast in a more controlled way, I guess.(...) But with that, I was like, man, I'm so stoked about this, and being here, and I'm thinking about starting a nonprofit. I don't know, this is something. I don't know what this is, but this is something. Knowing damn well, I don't have the attention span to fucking do the paperwork and all this shit, but I was just kind of thinking out loud. And he's like, well, that's what I'm doing. And I was like, dude, I'll do whatever, I can't boost your signal.(...) And I got invited to the next trip. I bought like a shitty GoPro, like a GoPro 2. And I didn't have financially right now, I'll be able to provide financially, right? Because I'm still paying child support and all these things, right? Life, it's expensive, houses, whatever, right? And I was like, I still wanna give something back. I started to create videos for them, and that kind of gave me the artistic capability, and it helped, right? And to put something together that I'm just trying to figure shit out.(...) Shortly after, like on these trips, I got invited to Big Ben, I brought my wife along. On my birthday, I bought her a mountain bike.(...) And like I said, it happened in reverse, man. I didn't, if I would've known it was a veteran nonprofit that I was going to, I wouldn't have gone, honestly. But it just happened, right? And through that, the riding bikes and stuff, and it sounds hokey as shit or woo woo, whatever, I really don't care at this point.(...) But I started to appreciate, it's like something was resonating within me(...) with nature and like God and all these things, right? And I'm still trying to define that for my own, right? Like what that is, because my upbringing is forcibly like, you will believe this, you know, whatever. And like, I'm not being able to ask questions. And that's unfolding for me, even as we speak, diving in different literatures and books and stuff like that. But with that, it's, yeah, it's been since 2018, give or take, we took our first trip. Actually, my crashing convos page, I put the first picture we took. It was us three, me, sport, that's his nickname, Kevin, and Jonathan in Bentonville, Arkansas, like on our first trip. And here we are, you know, and he passed away last time at 330, that's what I understand. But because of him, I'm in the place where I'm at. And thank God I got to tell him this much, right? When, you know, like before he passed and stuff, I got to go see him. And yeah, so that's what I kind of been doing. I've been having, doing this podcast, I've been video editing, trying to motivate others. Like initially I was trying to be very direct and talk about suicide prevention and then like for vets and first responders. And then I started to quickly realize that it's not just vets and first responders, it's actually like our society as a whole.(...) And it's like kind of talking about these things, like picking my spots, right? Because you talk about it's like a military, suicide prevention every year, every year, it becomes nothing, right? But if you kind of pick your spots and try to post something meaningful or whatever, hopefully it resonates better with that one individual, whoever. And that's kind of like slowly progressed and I have these conversations on trips. If it comes up, right? Like, so we just came off a last retreat in Angel Fire, New Mexico. We went to a downhill park, did an EMBA(...) for September 11th weekend. And we had about 24, 25 vets. And we've been doing that for like the last five or six years. And I just fell into it, man. And I just kind of been getting in where I fit in and try to help out in whatever way I can. And whether it's through a conversation whether it's cooking a meal, whether it's fixing their bikes to the muscle bike mechanic. I went to school for that in Oregon. So that's a bunch of different shit, man. It's a bunch of different shit at once. But to include this podcast, I enjoy having these conversations.(...) And I'm glad to have it with you because it's strange how, and forgive me if I'm like speaking too much, like man, it's fucking podcast about you, nothing. No, but it's interesting because I've been kind of, to some extent, like, I don't wanna say avoiding my past, but it's like, I understand who I was then. And I appreciate what I was then and from all the different reasons right now, I try to give myself some grace about that. But at the same time, it's like,(...) it's cool having you on because it's just like a reminder of my past and who I was, but I'm like slowly kind of re- Establishing your- Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like in this place that I am now. You know what I mean? And it's kind of, you know what I mean? Yeah, I feel you dude. So when I, that in particular, like I was in the band with Joe and Paul was, big Paul was there a lot.(...) But he obviously high school, so when I left the military, I went in essence almost right back to it, cause I was in the band with these dudes from high school. So it felt very high school in that sense. And that was 04 when we started. And I wanna say by 2007, the end of it or something like that, like the band shit was falling apart. Like it just wasn't working out with them anymore. And I moved on and did music shit with some other bands and stuff like that. And that was fun for a while. And, but I noticed that once I left the band, I didn't go back and fuck with those peeps anymore. And I don't know, I was like kind of, I was a little sour about it, you know, when it was over, in the sense of I felt like I was the one doing a lot of the footwork for the band, like making the flyers, doing the, passing them out, going to the clubs and the bars and introducing our band, trying to take our demo, scheduling the next, Yeah. Our next demo, scheduling our gigs. I was doing a lot of it. And when it was over for me, I was like, I'm fucking done. Yeah. I'm done with all that shit. Like burnt out. I'm fucking done. Like, I just want to get in the band, learn the music, play and perform. That's it. I don't want to fucking push any website. I don't want to, you know, whatever. Now there's Instagram and all that shit. So it, when I left it, I left it. Yeah. I hadn't, and what's strange though, that when I do come back to it, I always say like, why the fuck did I leave? Like, you know, not so much the band, but more my friends. Yeah. Who was it? David Notvice's daughter turned 16, had a quince there, I'm sorry, quince there, right? And I went to that and ran into Paul and Chris Almedis. I didn't run into Joe, but you know, just a lot of the old heads from that.(...) And man, like, it's like, fuck, I fucking love y'all, dude. And not that I never thought I didn't love them, but it was just like, I missed, it's like that love had been gone for so long. And now it's back and I can feel it again. It's like, oh man, it's so cool to feel, you know, have that, it's like, you remember, it's not like, you remember who you used to be. You still remember who you are, but it's only a part of you. It's like, oh yeah, I've become other things since then. Right. I love remembering where I came from. I'm like, fuck yeah. Because I don't know, man, everyone has their own life experience, but I like mine. My life was good, it was fun. You know, that time in my life, especially with the band and shit, like some of the most fun years of my life. There's nothing like performing a song and having 200 people sing the songs with you. Yeah, man. And they're your songs. I'm not talking cover songs, I'm talking our fucking songs. It's nothing like that. There's nothing like that feeling. Yeah. Yeah, kind of cool. I know, I was in the crowd, something like that. I know, dude.(Laughing) My wife was asking me about the podcast and I was telling her what I knew about it, you know, like the cause and stuff. And she's like, how do you know this dude? I'm like, actually, and I might be wrong, but we weren't in the same class, right? You were one or two. I was, I graduated with 97. 97, so two classes. So I'm like, it's what this dude, and I can't remember whether, we didn't graduate together, but it was one or two classes, I tell my wife about it or whatever.(...) And anyway, so we kind of got up on it. I was telling her, yeah, it's like fucking high school days. So fucking, like, it feels like a long time. It did, and it is, it's like a lifetime ago or a couple of lifetimes ago. 30 years ago now. Like, you know, I graduated at 95, so next year it'll be 30 years since I graduated. It's crazy. Yeah, it is. It's crazy. It moves exponentially faster too. It does. That's how I feel about it. And I mean, with that, it's like, yeah, and I feel the same way, right? I don't know why. And I think a lot of it is, like, we, or I'll speak for myself, I focus on a lot of the shit that I'm not proud of, right? And it's like, I wasn't ready to face that version of myself, you know? But at the same time, it's like, that's growth, right? It's like,(...) you were talking about earlier, right? Like seeing old art, right?(...) That's a version of you that you kind of left there. And now you can look back at it, like, fuck, I fucked up there, I fucked up there. But for me, it's like, I'm not focusing on all the positives of it, right? Or the growth that I've come to this point, right? And with that, it's like, as I'm saying this, I'm kind of understanding, like, I need to reconnect, right, with, like, Chris Guzman,(...) you know, like, all the boys, right? You know, and just kind of just,(...) just reconnect, you know? Like, see where they're at, what's up? It's, I'm still,(...) like, and it's interesting, like, when you go back around family, right? Do you, your older version of your, like, your family version comes out, right? And you start speaking Spanish or whatever, right? It's just, you just kind of fall into that. And it's, I hope it's the same thing, right? Because I have nothing but love for,(...) but for the guys and everything, and everything that I've, like, grown and understand myself to this point, because it's created who we are to this point, right? It's just, I just haven't done it, but I need to, you know what I mean? It's good to. Yeah, it's good to. Yeah, I think so. I mean, doesn't matter which situation you're in, you know, it's good to. Yeah. I think people only want to see other people when they're up,(...) when, if I'm doing good, that's when I want to go hang out with these motherfuckers, right? And, but if I'm doing bad, I don't want to go fuck with these dudes, because they're doing good and I'm not. I think that, I think that can be a mentality(...) that'll cause you to avoid, you know, go, you know, hanging out with a certain type or whatever. Yeah, yeah. And it's just the, you know, it's like,(...) it's because you, in your head, like you're letting yourself down, but you're not letting those guys down. Yeah. You know, just go and fucking be you, like, you know, like, they just want you there. They just, you know what I mean? Yeah. They don't need to see that you're doing so, you know, this or that, it's just, your presence. Yeah. It's dope, you know? And for me, I think it's more so, like, it's not necessarily this or that, like, being up or down. It's more for me, like,(...) I'm afraid. It's the same way that I,(...) when I stopped drinking, right? I was like, can I still be that same person, right? Because I, my alcohol kind of, the lines are blurred, right?(...) Like, identity wise, right? And so it's like part, like, yeah, I know I can go and have the discipline to not fall into those old habits, but at the same time, I'm a little afraid, if I'm being honest, that I may, and like, kind of erase everything I've done to this point. Does that make sense? Yeah, but it's not possible. Yeah, it's true. You know, like, it's just, you know, I think if anything, you know, grasp moments of a certain mental set, like, and maybe play in that mental set, but I think you or I, at least, you know, like, I think I put in too much, you know, like, the new me overrides the old me. Got you. 100%, so I can go right back, you know, the projects that I grew up in, we're still up, I could fucking walk right up to that door, and none of that old me would come out. Of course, the old you would feel it, right? Like, you know, I'd probably fucking cry, you know, like, fuck, I grew up here, this rat. But yeah, man, you know,(...) we're supposed to grow, and if you don't, you, I don't know, what the fuck? Oh, what the fuck? Yeah. You know, like, I guess you're happy in your little circle and whatever, but I don't know. Nothing wrong with having your Bud Light lifestyle. Yeah. There's nothing wrong with that. Right. It's just not for me anymore. Yeah. It's just not for me anymore. Yeah. Like, I don't, like, going out, going to be seen, you know, that shit kind of gets old for everybody, right? Like, you know. Well, at least it should. It should, like, that lifestyle, like, I don't know, like,(...) if I go to a bar right now and see a 70-year-old, 70-year-old dude sitting there, is it likely that he had a super productive lifestyle and has done these things and loved by many? I don't know. Yeah. Probably not, I'm guessing. Right. You know, unless it's just, you have this profound old man decide he's gonna go to the fucking bar one day. Yeah. Right, that's the one occasion, but besides that, some dude that go to the bar regularly and he's 70 years old, well, that's his fucking life. That's what he's doing, you know? Yeah. Because even within the bar scene, like, there's a community, right? Yeah, absolutely. Like, the same old people. Like, "Man, what's up, dude?" It's kind of like, "Cheers," right? Yeah, and I've, man, I got clients, and they talk about, you know, the drinking that they do, and for some of these dudes, it's, you know, and gals, it's just normal, it's like,"Oh, yeah, I go to work. "Go right to, you know, to the place." And that, I mean, if that's your social circle,(...) fine, but I guess the alcohol is the only thing, maybe, that brings it together. I mean, it's the most common thing, obviously, right? Yeah, because it's legal, too. Right, you don't go to the bar to exercise, you go to the bar to drink, right? So, I don't know, man. Like, that's why I have a couple beers at home.(...) (Laughing) Get my little buzz hanging out with my four-year-old, you know, it's so much cooler to play Hot Wheels, like when you got a little buzz. Yeah, man. Let's build a ramp, you know. Yeah. You're out taking over the Hot Wheel track, pushing the kid out of the way, "It's mine, no, this is my car, bro." Yeah.(...) But, so, what plans do you have going forward for your shop, or like, do you-- So, we just moved, we were on San Pedro. We moved several times, it's always a thing. We moved, the first time we moved, because the rent went up ridiculously, the second time we moved was, we were in a 100-year-old building, and they wouldn't upgrade anything. So, when it was hot outside, it's hot inside the building. When it was cold, it was fucking cold, dude. So, we decided to leave, we went over to San Pedro, and San Pedro was cool for the most part. We're near North Star Mall, but they opened up that, what was it,(...) the Immigration Processing Center? Like, the people that show up at the border are getting processed through this place, the old CPS building. Gotcha. Problem is, is that they allow them, while they're processing, they also allow them to roam San Pedro, right? Gotcha. You know what, it's free world, do your thing, you wanna roam, that's cool. But the problem is, there was hundreds or thousands of these dudes walking up and down San Pedro. Now, we're a cash-only business, for the most part. Some people hit us up digitally, but for the most part, we take cash. Well, there's a problem when I got people coming in with $1,000 in their pocket, and there's people asking them for money, as soon as they get out of their car, right? Anyway, so there's always issues.(...) There can always be issues, obviously, it's no matter where your business is at. So recently, we just moved, we're like right outside of, not Bao Coney's Heights, Alamo Heights, like we're on Akadocia's in 410, right on the other side of 410 is Alamo Heights. So our vibe at the new shop's totally different. And it's nice being in a new spot, you kinda set it up the way you want, stuff like that. It's a little bit smaller, it's a little bit tighter than our last shop. But we were paying for square footage that we didn't need to, and in commercial real estate, you don't wanna be spending rent on some shit you're not using, because it's expensive. As far as future plans go,(...) we've, honestly,(...) I couldn't see past the move.(...) So it was hard for, we've probably been in there two, three months now, and now that the dust is settling,(...) I'm like, okay, now what can, what do I wanna get back to? And we've been pushing off our merch forever, so I wanna start pushing a little bit more merch. We all wear clothes, we gotta wear clothes, it's so weird to me that we push merch off, because every single person that comes into the shop asks,"Have you got new shirts?" And I'm always saying no, and it's fucking terrible, because they, almost every day, someone asks, "You got a new shirt?" We got the same fucking ones from a year and a half ago, dude, so. I eventually want to move, or open a studio in Burnie, to work at, but more of a private setting. Burnie's one of those very,(...) it's a small town, they're still getting tattoos, there's a lot of money, when there isn't a tattoo shop there. And like I said, I'm driving 40 or 50 minutes to get to San Antonio, so that and back, we're talking, if we round up, I'm losing two hours a day driving, so it'd be kinda cool to tattoo in Burnie. Save my two hours, spend two more hours with my son, or I don't know, spend two more hours tattooing, I don't know, whatever, so. It doesn't seem like a whole lot, but when you add it up, it does seem like a lot to me. Especially when you factor in time. Timely ass, right? But time, the bigger one. Yeah, time. The only one I can't get back. Yup. So, it's valuable. So, hopefully maybe open up a little studio in the next five years or something like that in Burnie, that I can work at privately. Okay. Yeah. So, when you get your merch out,(...) where can people get that merch? Basically, we do,(...) we sell it in-house. Okay.(...) But, oh, that was another thing, is we did take down our website, we weren't so stoked about the people that were having our SEO and website before.(...) So, we need to find new people. Gotcha. To do that. So, we got a new website. The ideas and stuff are all rolling around, but we haven't solidified anything. But, our old website didn't have a merch area, and we want our new website to definitely have a merch area and stuff like that, people can show. I got a couple people that are website designers that can just shoot them your way and whatever happens happens. That'd be rad, dude, because, like I said, I didn't really like the last one.(...) So, and I personally know our last internet dude, a great guy, but he has so many accounts. You know what I mean? Yeah, gotcha. Restaurants and lawyers, and we're a small fish. Gotcha. For his, you know, for his business. Gotcha. So, we kind of, I felt like we kind of fell off the radar a little bit. Gotcha. So, it was time to go. Yeah, man, there's always time, you gotta keep moving. Yeah, and you know, it's time for a new website.(...) We had that old one for five years, which is ancient,(...) according to the way things move. It seems like you gotta have a new website like every two, three years, or at least the layout needs to look different. Otherwise,(...) shit gets old to people, I guess, or whatever. So, last two things before we end is, what advice would you give for new shop owners(...) and the lessons learned that you've tried to push through in any business, and lastly, like, just plug where people can find you? So, advice, it's hard to give advice, because everyone's situation's different. I think if I give any advice, it would be to people that want to become tattooers,(...) and one of the biggest pieces of advice that I can give anybody is draw. It sounds so stupid, but draw.(...) Like, there's so many people that don't know,"Oh, dude, you do what you do." Yeah, I fucking draw, though. It's inglorious,(...) and you don't get any props, but you have to get used to that, because that's what most of tattooing is. It's inglorious. You sit there alone, and it's like, "Oh, how the fuck did that make any sense?" You have clients every day. That's true, but if my client doesn't get there until two, and his session is over at six, I got hours of tattooing. Oh, I got hours of prep time, drawing, stuff like that. I don't do that with my client. I don't do that with anybody. I do that by myself.(...) So, if you want to become a tattoo artist, specifically, start drawing. And if you're in a month, you find like, "Oh, fucking, I stopped drawing." Well, then you don't want to be a tattoo artist. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? How can you say you want to do the thing when you don't even do the thing? That doesn't make any sense. That would be my first piece of advice, and my second piece of advice is be prepared to fucking get a lot, to get let down. Like, you're not gonna walk into your favorite tattoo shop and walk in with your pretty little fucking drawings, and they're gonna be like, "Oh, you're the greatest. "Let's hire you." It's not the process. First off, you walk in, you have some talent, they're like, "Oh, cool." Have I tattooed you? And of course, your answer is no, no, no. I just met you 10 minutes ago. Cool. Well, I need to put a couple fucking sleeves on you before you can even decide whether you like this lifestyle. You like what we do. Right. And then, at that point, you might be interested in tattooing. You need to be at least heavily tattooed and drawing every single day, in my opinion, to make it, to even have a chance at making it. Gotcha. And especially because we're in an oversaturated business right now. There's way too many tattooers. When I started tattooing, it was 70 shops. When we opened up our shop, it was 70 shops, and now there's, I think, over 250. Damn. Yeah, and there aren't any more clients where San Antonio's grown, but not the way that's grown. So you have to be a stand-up now. It's hard for new people, because there's,(...) besides your internet hype and all your friends hyping you up and telling you that you're dope,(...) like, what else do you got? What else do you have? You don't have much. And yeah, you can try to sell sexuality or whatever your gimmick is in order to get more people in your door, but that isn't gonna bring you any fucking respect, not even from those clients. So it's interesting. So yeah, I would say draw a lot. Be prepared to be let down, because there's a lot of negativity in the tattoo world. It's a tough world to be in, for sure. I was gonna say one. What the fuck was I gonna say? I don't know. And then yeah, pretty much just have jakevaldez.com, Jake Valdez on Instagram. And I don't push my Facebook. It's more personal. Yeah, yeah. Type of page. What about Flesh Electric? Fleshelectricstudio.com. Our website should be up soon. And I believe we're Flesh Electric Tattoo on Instagram. Okay. We don't do TikTok. We haven't jumped on any of those. We're kind of old school in that sense, which is actually a kind of drawback in the sense, we should have made a TikTok forever ago. Go draw it back to getting comfortable where you're at, right? So anyway, but that's the easiest way to find me. Come see me at the shop, man. It's one of those, we can converse over DM. And that's one thing, that's one level. But coming and talking about the tattoo, and having a conversation, that's a totally different consultation than sending me, hey, I want a dragon on my arm. And you're saying, cool, when do you want to get it? That's kind of fucking boring. Come by the shop and let's chop it up about a tattoo. And take it from there. So that's how I recommend doing it, the old school way. There you go. So I need to go check out the shop too. I haven't been there yet. Come see me, man. Yeah. Especially when you found appreciation for your passion, your art. I mean, I appreciate it virtually, but just because I draw a little bit, but nothing on your level. And then secondly, having this conversation. But yeah, man, I appreciate it. Earlier you were saying something, and this is obviously, we're about done, but-- No, you're good. You're talking about creativity. And right now you kind of threw it out there, saying that you're not as creative as me, but you are. And it's different.(...) And I hear this all the time. And I read this in a book recently Rick Rubin's book. Okay. Can't remember the name of the-- Atomic Habits, or is that Rick Rubin?(...) Maybe that's Jordan Peterson. Maybe. But he basically said that we're all creative. If you decide you want to take a different route to work, you'll find a different route to work. If the dog decided that she's gonna start peeing at the front stairs, you would figure out a way(...) in order to make that stop. That takes creativity. When you're cooking your next meal, if you're tired of having this, you're gonna give it a splash of this instead. That's creativity. Putting together the outfit that you're gonna wear for the day, or the way women comb their hair for the day, or the makeup that they wear, that's creativity.(...) We all are required to be creative throughout our day, but we don't appreciate our own creativity for the most part. And I think that people often bring themselves, it's almost like a mentality. I'm not creative, but you're creative. I'm like, no, that's bullshit. I'm creative on screen. I'm creative because I have to be. I have to show this. But you can't show,(...) it's hard to show if you're gonna cook your food different. So it's different. I'm forced to show my creativity all day long, so I give the illusion of being more creative. But I don't think that I'm more creative than anybody else. That's fair. Yeah. So there you go.(...) Yeah, man, so that was a creative way to put that. Thanks for having me on the show. Yeah, man. It was super fun, dude. I'm glad you enjoyed it, and I look forward to having you back on. And if you guys are listening, this is gonna be available. I say this all the time, but I just want people to be aware. It's streaming on our platform, Spotify, Apple, Pandora, et cetera. It's also on YouTube. I'm thinking about going on Rumble, but it's just one more thing to maintain. And one stop, I'm the only dude here, so I'm doing it on one man. One man. Yeah, one man.(...) You're doing a great job, dude. Thanks, man. Yeah, dude. Appreciate it. And thanks for coming on. Thanks for driving all this way. It's probably took you two fucking hours. Yeah, it's an hour away, Bernie. I took the scenic route. Oh, nice. I like that route. Yeah, it's cool. Yeah, dude, I love it. Yeah, man, thanks again for coming on, and thanks for everyone listening. If you feel like this will help anyone, our conversation, or just enjoy it, please share this with a friend or family member, and just keep those conversations going. And if you think you have somebody that would be interested in the conversation, shoot it my way. I appreciate your time and energy, and yeah, and your presence. Thanks, guys. All right, all right, man, out. That was fun, dude. I'm glad you enjoyed it, man. How long was that? I'll tell you right now. Hour and 55 minutes. Okay, let's go.(...) (Groaning) Let me stop this. The programming isn't.
